12 comments
roxcyn | 31-08-2015 06:31
It sounds like a good idea and other forums have that option.
PracticePractic | 15-11-2015 05:45
Joey just today 11 November 2015, commented :
about the idea of numbering the posts so I can be directed to a particular one out of 1863 in a thread! So bumping this topic up again!
I added in a request for others here to note if this is a needed feature of LSI, or is it just a "cool" but unnecessary one to help Ray decide if he should do it or not...
(See my screenshots above that still work, showing what it would look like if we did it)
Indeed. Go and tell Ray!
about the idea of numbering the posts so I can be directed to a particular one out of 1863 in a thread! So bumping this topic up again!
I added in a request for others here to note if this is a needed feature of LSI, or is it just a "cool" but unnecessary one to help Ray decide if he should do it or not...
(See my screenshots above that still work, showing what it would look like if we did it)
roxcyn | 15-11-2015 05:51
PP - send him a PM. Word Reference numbers their posts IIRC and they offer a blocking function if Ray wanted an example.
Captain_Keeta | 15-11-2015 05:53
That seems like a lot of effort and coding for something like this. Although it would be cool, doesn't seem necessary though, IMO.
Ray | 12-09-2016 10:32
Hey guys,
This one was still on my list.
It's not that hard to implement, that's the good thing
But there is more. As you know I prefer not to have any unnecessary bling-bling on the site anywhere. Things evolve from unnecessary to necessary when a significant part of the users thinks it is usefull. I'm not sure if that's the case here. Perhaps wrapping the idea in a poll is an idea?
But even if this idea is marked as "necessary", there is possible dealbreaker because of a functional problem. Sometimes comments are deleted. If you would like to use comment numbering to refer to them, they can't be re-numbered after deleting a comment. But the pagination is reordered. That would lead to the pagination being out of sync with the comment numbering.
An example in normal english; A thread has 110 comments. On page 1 you delete post number 12. On top of page 1 you still see (pagination) "showing 1 to 25". You expect the last comment being number 25, but that is now number 26 after deleting number 12. This out-of sync is confusing. I can't think of a (nice) fix for this. Ideas?
This one was still on my list.
It's not that hard to implement, that's the good thing
But there is more. As you know I prefer not to have any unnecessary bling-bling on the site anywhere. Things evolve from unnecessary to necessary when a significant part of the users thinks it is usefull. I'm not sure if that's the case here. Perhaps wrapping the idea in a poll is an idea?But even if this idea is marked as "necessary", there is possible dealbreaker because of a functional problem. Sometimes comments are deleted. If you would like to use comment numbering to refer to them, they can't be re-numbered after deleting a comment. But the pagination is reordered. That would lead to the pagination being out of sync with the comment numbering.
An example in normal english; A thread has 110 comments. On page 1 you delete post number 12. On top of page 1 you still see (pagination) "showing 1 to 25". You expect the last comment being number 25, but that is now number 26 after deleting number 12. This out-of sync is confusing. I can't think of a (nice) fix for this. Ideas?
PracticePractic | 12-09-2016 12:50
Hi Ray!
Thanks for thinking of it! I know you have a lot on your plate and your recent revelation (!) that the new pages will look more like the comments sections of our Profile has been a real help in thinking about any new "killer ideas".
That said--- if (see below) it is chosen to do this addition, "now" would be the perfect time as you only changed the comments section (so far). That means while you're working on the design (re-design) of the other sections, it would be very easy (I assume) to add in the extra tag/command that does this. I've seen it elsewhere so I know it automatically counts upward from wherever you start it (like the beginning of a new thread/topic).
So as I mentioned and you agree its not taxing to you to implement this addition.
As to if it is really necessary---I can open a simple poll later today and see who responds and how many for one side or the other (unless someone wants to write it in a shorter form than I will probably do).
My suggestions for the two paragraphs of quotes above?
1. Many sites (I can give you the ones I use) use the numbering process (yes even with all the clutter of their sites they seem to enjoy having the ability to directly reference back to an earlier quote or phrase no matter how far back in time it was---
Thinking this might make it easier to do this so more conversation would occur as now we have easily available the entirely of the 12 years of LSI Forum comments, etc to draw upon.
You can either reveal the codes for the sites to figure out how they did it---handled in programming the pagination problem you mentioned above---or even just write a webmaster or two (we can do that for you if we can express it in programming ideas like you did simply in paragraph 1 quoted above), asking how they handle the problem of deleted posts effecting the pages.
2. Now here is my simpler method----
When someone does not provide an "avatar" for use in the Forum, there is a placeholder blank one, correct? Well, consider that a removed/edited out comment never really goes away with a numbered system---it will remain as a very very thin line---no avatar--no name---just numbered as a permanent "placeholder" a "zero" "null" entry.
* That way there is no interruption in numbering.
* That way there is no need for the system to be continually re-numbering things.
* That way, if a mod decides for "language" or any other reason to delete a posting after the 15 minute time period for editing has passed----and most especially important: if some others have written answers to that one which are kept/retained---then retaining the old numbering would not disturb what has been written in subsequent posts. (a long sentence, I'll explain below in two examples.)
Example 1: The way we would think this occurs, that you remove the entire post and renumber the posts as well as the pages, then in a sequence of posts:
#1, #2, #3, #4 (where #4 is deemed to have to be removed by mods)
It takes an hour to do this....meanwhile, members have replied to #4 Thus:
#1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, # 7, #8
With numbers 5,6,7,8 all containing the important phrase:
Now if Post #4 vanishes---and the new #5 is renumbered (and 6 and 7 and 8) to reflect it....then all of those posts refer to number 4 which is the old number 5 renumbered...
Stop!
Example 2= easier method to accomplish same action.....
#1, #2, #3, #4 and we want to erase #4.
1 hr later just as the post #4 has been erased, more comments were added about #4. (which is being deleted, so no one can read what it said).
#1, #2, #3, #4 (remains as a numbered item, but is now a blank one line object on the page)
Then the following posts that came after it: #5, #6, #7 and #8 are unaffected by the removal of the content of #4 and all of the numbers are kept in order from then on without any wondering how the numbers and their content (i.e. see first example where it referred to a missing #4 that has been made to replace the old #5).
* That way the pagination will still show page 1 containing posts 1 through 25, but lets say #4 was inappropriate---so the number "#4" only will remain, but is an empty single line with no content.
-----
In summary:
Easy method to fix the very clear problem you raise, all while keeping the site and Forum postings in order is to retain the line no matter what happens to the content.
This unfortunately (yes I can write against my own idea) means that for all the spammers who dump into the Forum threads occasionally---their contents and their bad email pishing addresses will vanish...but their "mark" upon the site will remain as a single line--no avatar (and no "missing avatar" square box to take up room in reading the posts) and easily skipped over in reading the posts that matter in the threads.
Your opinion? Others?
This one was still on my list.
Thanks for thinking of it! I know you have a lot on your plate and your recent revelation (!) that the new pages will look more like the comments sections of our Profile has been a real help in thinking about any new "killer ideas".
That said--- if (see below) it is chosen to do this addition, "now" would be the perfect time as you only changed the comments section (so far). That means while you're working on the design (re-design) of the other sections, it would be very easy (I assume) to add in the extra tag/command that does this. I've seen it elsewhere so I know it automatically counts upward from wherever you start it (like the beginning of a new thread/topic).
It's not that hard to implement, that's the good thing But there is more. As you know I prefer not to have any unnecessary bling-bling on the site anywhere. Things evolve from unnecessary to necessary when a significant part of the users thinks it is usefull. I'm not sure if that's the case here. Perhaps wrapping the idea in a poll is an idea?
So as I mentioned and you agree its not taxing to you to implement this addition.
As to if it is really necessary---I can open a simple poll later today and see who responds and how many for one side or the other (unless someone wants to write it in a shorter form than I will probably do).
Sometimes comments are deleted. If you would like to use comment numbering to refer to them, they can't be re-numbered after deleting a comment. But the pagination is reordered. That would lead to the pagination being out of sync with the comment numbering.
An example in normal english; A thread has 110 comments. On page 1 you delete post number 12. On top of page 1 you still see (pagination) "showing 1 to 25". You expect the last comment being number 25, but that is now number 26 after deleting number 12. This out-of sync is confusing. I can't think of a (nice) fix for this. Ideas?
My suggestions for the two paragraphs of quotes above?
1. Many sites (I can give you the ones I use) use the numbering process (yes even with all the clutter of their sites they seem to enjoy having the ability to directly reference back to an earlier quote or phrase no matter how far back in time it was---
Thinking this might make it easier to do this so more conversation would occur as now we have easily available the entirely of the 12 years of LSI Forum comments, etc to draw upon.
You can either reveal the codes for the sites to figure out how they did it---handled in programming the pagination problem you mentioned above---or even just write a webmaster or two (we can do that for you if we can express it in programming ideas like you did simply in paragraph 1 quoted above), asking how they handle the problem of deleted posts effecting the pages.
2. Now here is my simpler method----
When someone does not provide an "avatar" for use in the Forum, there is a placeholder blank one, correct? Well, consider that a removed/edited out comment never really goes away with a numbered system---it will remain as a very very thin line---no avatar--no name---just numbered as a permanent "placeholder" a "zero" "null" entry.
* That way there is no interruption in numbering.
* That way there is no need for the system to be continually re-numbering things.
* That way, if a mod decides for "language" or any other reason to delete a posting after the 15 minute time period for editing has passed----and most especially important: if some others have written answers to that one which are kept/retained---then retaining the old numbering would not disturb what has been written in subsequent posts. (a long sentence, I'll explain below in two examples.)
Example 1: The way we would think this occurs, that you remove the entire post and renumber the posts as well as the pages, then in a sequence of posts:
#1, #2, #3, #4 (where #4 is deemed to have to be removed by mods)
It takes an hour to do this....meanwhile, members have replied to #4 Thus:
#1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, # 7, #8
With numbers 5,6,7,8 all containing the important phrase:
Writing about Post #4.
Now if Post #4 vanishes---and the new #5 is renumbered (and 6 and 7 and 8) to reflect it....then all of those posts refer to number 4 which is the old number 5 renumbered...
Stop!
Example 2= easier method to accomplish same action.....
#1, #2, #3, #4 and we want to erase #4.
1 hr later just as the post #4 has been erased, more comments were added about #4. (which is being deleted, so no one can read what it said).
#1, #2, #3, #4 (remains as a numbered item, but is now a blank one line object on the page)
Then the following posts that came after it: #5, #6, #7 and #8 are unaffected by the removal of the content of #4 and all of the numbers are kept in order from then on without any wondering how the numbers and their content (i.e. see first example where it referred to a missing #4 that has been made to replace the old #5).
* That way the pagination will still show page 1 containing posts 1 through 25, but lets say #4 was inappropriate---so the number "#4" only will remain, but is an empty single line with no content.
-----
In summary:
Easy method to fix the very clear problem you raise, all while keeping the site and Forum postings in order is to retain the line no matter what happens to the content.
This unfortunately (yes I can write against my own idea) means that for all the spammers who dump into the Forum threads occasionally---their contents and their bad email pishing addresses will vanish...but their "mark" upon the site will remain as a single line--no avatar (and no "missing avatar" square box to take up room in reading the posts) and easily skipped over in reading the posts that matter in the threads.
Your opinion? Others?
roxcyn | 13-09-2016 04:30
The other forum will leave the post that got deleted and it puts a standard message "this post has been deleted". I can make a poll about it.
PracticePractic | 13-09-2016 08:50
Thank you Scot for doing that and helping me!
Ray | 19-09-2016 20:34
Thanks for thinking along
So in short, there are 3 options:
1) renumber all comments when a comment is deleted and either accept broken references or renumber references also
2) don't renumber and accept inconsistent pagination
3) keep deleted comments in some short of way
Option 1 and 2 are not workable, so that leaves us with option 3. I think keeping deleted comments is a too big price to be able to keep the correct pagination. Remember my unnecassary things allergy? Once deleted, I don't want to see anything anymore that reminds me to a comment that the comment was once there. A lot of deleted comments are spam related. I want to see spam removed without a trace, as if it never was there. Visually this approach looks the best way and also from the Google's quality guidelines perspective, this is the best solution.
Let's put this idea on hold until we have new ideas to will lead to a workable solution. Sorry guys.
So in short, there are 3 options:
1) renumber all comments when a comment is deleted and either accept broken references or renumber references also
2) don't renumber and accept inconsistent pagination
3) keep deleted comments in some short of way
Option 1 and 2 are not workable, so that leaves us with option 3. I think keeping deleted comments is a too big price to be able to keep the correct pagination. Remember my unnecassary things allergy? Once deleted, I don't want to see anything anymore that reminds me to a comment that the comment was once there. A lot of deleted comments are spam related. I want to see spam removed without a trace, as if it never was there. Visually this approach looks the best way and also from the Google's quality guidelines perspective, this is the best solution.
Let's put this idea on hold until we have new ideas to will lead to a workable solution. Sorry guys.
PracticePractic | 19-09-2016 22:05
Ok Ray 
Thanks for thinking it through with the three options. I really appreciate it when someone takes my ideas seriously and tries them out. I don't mind failing now, we might get it in the future.....
Before I let it die for now, just let me have one more gasp at a straw (I had this in case in the planning stages in case that poll went against the idea of numbering the posts.
In your new clean method of displaying the "Comments" (which will be how the posts are displayed someday) I noticed instead of the little "gear" image you have the three ellipses boxes or dots in a vertical row at the right end of the comment bar. (I can insert in here later a link to show it as a screenshot and circle it if you are unsure what I'm talking about).
Just a thought...... My camera phone is not Apple, but it has very clean images. It has same thing you got, a icon (options) that you can "click" on and under "information" you can get all the complicated messy stuff you don't want to see on the actual page taking up room from the simple photo view.
Applying that concept to LetsSingIt:
Right now (during editing phase) there are two yellow boxes that appear:
Left to right:
[Edit this comment ] [Report this comment.]
How about?
[Edit this comment ] [Report this comment] [Information]
Under "Information" you can have the computer list the exact post number for those that want it----you can also list "forever" the exact time of the post--time the post was completed editing of course so no confusion---- so that it can be accessed not as 15 days ago or 5-10-2012 dates but have it say in "information" more details for those who like that kind of stuff such as 10:42 p.m. 5-10-2012.
Some benefits of this:
* That way you maintain a clean look
* That way its always hidden, unless someone wants or needs the information.
* That way, for the future, the computer or program quietly gathers the information and no pagination problem occurs as you just "delete" the bad post, the rest renumber and the page remains the same as its "behind the scenes" and only if you look do you see the hidden information.
* That way, (its your choice), eliminating the spam can take place as its behind the scenes and if its "inconsistent" in any way it will not be displayed like that for everyone to notice the missing number or "null" blank space of a deleted post. Its just what happens when I delete a photo....the rest stay as they are numbered and the deleted photo and its number vanishes "forever"----I know the camera phone's simplistic program can do it, so maybe you can program that to do it too.
I'm sure you can take that idea and maybe use it to place a few more currently distracting items under the "information" click box (not the like button of course---too many would complain) but other items that you feel are still cluttering up the comment or posting area and keep it just for posts and the avatar image, number of posts (or maybe that goes behind the scenes as "information"? Get the idea?
Just thinking from a programming angle, it might make the pages run faster/quicker/nimbler if you make that "information" area something that get "refreshed " secondary (i.e. afterwards in priority) to the full pages of posts being refreshed, so less information, less drain on resources, more nimble and quicker responding page for the music lyrics as well on mobile devices I am thinking (but not totally familiar with those programming attributes as yet).
Long description shortened to just saying, how about placing the unnecessary bits of posts etc in a hidden area so by clicking on that is when it is refreshed, so only those of us who are desirous of the information have to click and wait for it to appear.
* offtopic :
I didn't write a support thread complaint about this new item (maybe due to times you are loading in new features to the site)
But I see on my Laptop (unless I'm at fault for doing too much work at once which might cause this problem anyway), that when I click on the thread link on the activity page, or when I first post a new post in a long thread (not here, but Randomness mostly)----my avatar does not appear, it is a vertical line, as well as the time and date not appearing until I either wait a few minutes for the auto-refresh of my computer to take effect, or by pressing F5 and force it to refresh the page---then everything appears as it should be.
SO that is where I think things on the site could be operating a bit faster if the main loading coding didn't have to collect and display everything right away, but can hold some choice items back--in the "information" yellow box, only to be refreshed when clicked upon (that way I get my numbering system as well----sorry for the "other motive" for suggesting this option).
Thanks for thinking it through with the three options. I really appreciate it when someone takes my ideas seriously and tries them out. I don't mind failing now, we might get it in the future.....
Before I let it die for now, just let me have one more gasp at a straw (I had this in case in the planning stages in case that poll went against the idea of numbering the posts.
In your new clean method of displaying the "Comments" (which will be how the posts are displayed someday) I noticed instead of the little "gear" image you have the three ellipses boxes or dots in a vertical row at the right end of the comment bar. (I can insert in here later a link to show it as a screenshot and circle it if you are unsure what I'm talking about).
Just a thought...... My camera phone is not Apple, but it has very clean images. It has same thing you got, a icon (options) that you can "click" on and under "information" you can get all the complicated messy stuff you don't want to see on the actual page taking up room from the simple photo view.
Applying that concept to LetsSingIt:
Right now (during editing phase) there are two yellow boxes that appear:
Left to right:
[Edit this comment ] [Report this comment.]
How about?
[Edit this comment ] [Report this comment] [Information]
Under "Information" you can have the computer list the exact post number for those that want it----you can also list "forever" the exact time of the post--time the post was completed editing of course so no confusion---- so that it can be accessed not as 15 days ago or 5-10-2012 dates but have it say in "information" more details for those who like that kind of stuff such as 10:42 p.m. 5-10-2012.
Some benefits of this:
* That way you maintain a clean look
* That way its always hidden, unless someone wants or needs the information.
* That way, for the future, the computer or program quietly gathers the information and no pagination problem occurs as you just "delete" the bad post, the rest renumber and the page remains the same as its "behind the scenes" and only if you look do you see the hidden information.
* That way, (its your choice), eliminating the spam can take place as its behind the scenes and if its "inconsistent" in any way it will not be displayed like that for everyone to notice the missing number or "null" blank space of a deleted post. Its just what happens when I delete a photo....the rest stay as they are numbered and the deleted photo and its number vanishes "forever"----I know the camera phone's simplistic program can do it, so maybe you can program that to do it too.
I'm sure you can take that idea and maybe use it to place a few more currently distracting items under the "information" click box (not the like button of course---too many would complain) but other items that you feel are still cluttering up the comment or posting area and keep it just for posts and the avatar image, number of posts (or maybe that goes behind the scenes as "information"? Get the idea?
Just thinking from a programming angle, it might make the pages run faster/quicker/nimbler if you make that "information" area something that get "refreshed " secondary (i.e. afterwards in priority) to the full pages of posts being refreshed, so less information, less drain on resources, more nimble and quicker responding page for the music lyrics as well on mobile devices I am thinking (but not totally familiar with those programming attributes as yet).
Long description shortened to just saying, how about placing the unnecessary bits of posts etc in a hidden area so by clicking on that is when it is refreshed, so only those of us who are desirous of the information have to click and wait for it to appear.
* offtopic :
I didn't write a support thread complaint about this new item (maybe due to times you are loading in new features to the site)
But I see on my Laptop (unless I'm at fault for doing too much work at once which might cause this problem anyway), that when I click on the thread link on the activity page, or when I first post a new post in a long thread (not here, but Randomness mostly)----my avatar does not appear, it is a vertical line, as well as the time and date not appearing until I either wait a few minutes for the auto-refresh of my computer to take effect, or by pressing F5 and force it to refresh the page---then everything appears as it should be.
SO that is where I think things on the site could be operating a bit faster if the main loading coding didn't have to collect and display everything right away, but can hold some choice items back--in the "information" yellow box, only to be refreshed when clicked upon (that way I get my numbering system as well----sorry for the "other motive" for suggesting this option).
guest
Read more:
So that got me to thinking.....
Some sites actually list the number of the post on the post.
LSI says just the total number of posts on the page, i.e. numbers 51 to 75 in this Screenshot
How about numbering the posts so we can refer backwards to a post made a day ago, without clumsy references to the date or time?
Screenshot shows how it might look (and correction in my sentence as if I had that number easily available from the box of the other posting)
Numbering the posts can be useful to referring to other people's posts as well as one's own. (I can recall someone posting recently that they just reviewed something they wrote here 9 years ago and commented on it... would have been nice if they said _____ thread, post number 226 or something easy like that I could have looked it up!)
Of course counter to my suggestion is the problem of what to do with the older postings.. would they all be able to be automatically numbered without upsetting the spacing and order of the older threads? Or maybe we just declare September 1st 2015, (I'm not saying it has to be ready by then its just a suggestion start date) as the date the new numbering system is in effect for all new posts only (or any posts added to older threads)......
Trying to keep idea simple and easy for Ray to do without much coding effort.
Hope everyone likes the idea.
Practice.