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homosexuals gain favor in Iowa
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| read 190 reaction(s) |
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@ 31-08-2007 11:56 WH1 | 290 posts
 | An Iowa district court judge ruled against
the natural laws of nature and ok'ed lesbians
and homosexuals to dysfunctionally marry in
that now Sodom and Gomorrah state.
title of this thread has been changed -- PF |
| Showing posts 126-150 of 190 | Page 6 of 8 |
| Discussion |
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 0  @ 01-11-2007 14:44 superman14 | 
365 posts
| I think the interpretations are wrong and narrow-minded
I'd rather be narrow-minded than water down God's Word | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 14:56 KateKateKate | 
5,285 posts
| That's not true. If it was, I'd try to justify every time I did something cruel to my brother. I'd try to justify every time I hurt my dad's feelings. I'd try to justify a lot of things. But I don't. I don't have a problem with the Bible, and I don't feel the need to water it down to anything.
The problem with Christianity (and everything in general) comes in when people don't have a good balance of thinking with the heart and thinking with the head. The people who think with the head take Scripture completely literally...and actually end up missing the entire point of the Bible. And that's done nothing but cause problems. The people who think too much with the heart act on every single impulse they have..."follow their heart" if you will, and do stupid things, which also causes waaaay too many problems. In fact I'd be willing to argue those are the only two things that ever screw up our world.
I just didn't decide on an impulse I was gay, and therefore it was ok, and then go and search for things to justify it. It was a long process, and it was all because there were people who were telling me it was wrong but couldn't really give me a good reason as to why, other than Scriptures with no logical backing as to why being gay is a sin. Eventually someone has to say enough. I see homophobia everywhere, and misunderstandings of what it means to be gay everywhere, and it makes me sick. It's time it ended.
And for the record, being gay is not a lifestyle. A lifestyle is choosing to be promiscuous in your sexuality, straight or gay. A lifestyle is if I went to bars every night, picking uo a new girl. Sexual orientation does not equal lifestyle. | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 14:58 KateKateKate |
5,285 posts
| And also, I think the whole "I can sin however much I want because I accept Jesus and he loves me and I have no responsibility except to tell everyone how much I love Jesus" is watering down the Scriptures waaaay more than anything I've said. But now I must go to school. | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 15:41 fishmunky | 
20,436 posts
| i don't like people who use scripture as the base for everything...homosexuality is an abomination to the lord?
well here's some interesting things in the scripture:
Exodus 21: 7: it sanctions selling your daughter into slavery
Lev.15:19- 24: no contact with women during their period of menstual uncleanliness, must make the work environment awkward huh?
Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations, does this mean i may own an american or a mexican as long as i pay?
Exodus 35:2 says that people who work on the sabbath should be put to death? how many wal mart have you burned down that were open on sundays?
Lev. 11:10: says that eating shellfish is an abomination. is this abomination on par with homosexuality. If so why aren't red lobsters boycotted en masse
seriously with all these ridiculous laws, how can you look at these laws here and then say yeah, the homosexuality one stands alone as the voice of reason law in the midst of all these inane and outdated archaic ones, its silly and hypocritical, if you really "live by scripture", i personally think you should go all or nothing, otherwise YOU are deliberately distorting scripture to suit your faith | 0 @ 01-11-2007 16:07 Dagor | 
34,870 posts
| Fine people already came to the conclusion a few centuries ago that the bible is not an adequate document to build a fair society on.
And those "fine" people you refer to are what are known as pure idiots.
I was referring to those great politicians in countries all over the world who made the foundations of democracy by establishing a consitution. Or is a constitution crap too? | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 17:56 superman14 |
365 posts
| That's not true. If it was, I'd try to justify every time I did something cruel to my brother. I'd try to justify every time I hurt my dad's feelings. I'd try to justify a lot of things. But I don't. I don't have a problem with the Bible, and I don't feel the need to water it down to anything.
If you don't have a problem with it, why are you arguing it?
The problem with Christianity (and everything in general) comes in when people don't have a good balance of thinking with the heart and thinking with the head. The people who think with the head take Scripture completely literally...and actually end up missing the entire point of the Bible. And that's done nothing but cause problems. The people who think too much with the heart act on every single impulse they have..."follow their heart" if you will, and do stupid things, which also causes waaaay too many problems. In fact I'd be willing to argue those are the only two things that ever screw up our world.
You're supossed to take scripture literally! Everything in the Bible is relevant to today. Of course you probably don't agree with that either
I just didn't decide on an impulse I was gay, and therefore it was ok, and then go and search for things to justify it. It was a long process, and it was all because there were people who were telling me it was wrong but couldn't really give me a good reason as to why, other than Scriptures with no logical backing as to why being gay is a sin. Eventually someone has to say enough. I see homophobia everywhere, and misunderstandings of what it means to be gay everywhere, and it makes me sick. It's time it ended.
If you can't take scripture as truth you got a problem. You should be able to read it and say what God said is true!
And for the record, being gay is not a lifestyle. A lifestyle is choosing to be promiscuous in your sexuality, straight or gay. A lifestyle is if I went to bars every night, picking uo a new girl. Sexual orientation does not equal lifestyle.
Acctually it is. Just like being a Christian is a life-style, being gay is a life-style | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 17:58 superman14 |
365 posts
| And also, I think the whole "I can sin however much I want because I accept Jesus and he loves me and I have no responsibility except to tell everyone how much I love Jesus" is watering down the Scriptures waaaay more than anything I've said.
Hmm...gee when did I say that? Wait I didn't! Not only are watering down God's word, but even mine. While yes I do sin (who doesn't) I don't believe I can just go around and do what I want! | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:00 Cheater138 | 
19,053 posts
| she didn't say you said that.. she said that's worse than anything she's said. | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:02 Dagor |
34,870 posts
| Acctually it is. Just like being a Christian is a life-style, being gay is a life-style
You are so naive, it almost hurts | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:07 KateKateKate |
5,285 posts
| 1. I'm not arguing with the Scripture, I'm arguing with your interpretation of it.
2. It's not about interpreting the Scripture literally or not, it's about understanding the time, place, and reasons why everything was said. If you don't understand the context of the time, then you don't understand what it REALLY meant, do you? So I'm not the one who isn't interpreting the Bible literally, it's you, because you're not looking at what was actually going on in that time and have no understanding of the facts or the language, and what effect translation can have on meaning.
3. Everything the Scripture has to say is indeed relevant today, but that is of course providing that you actually understand what it's saying, which means looking at the facts that deal with it.
4. I think it's funny how I'm one of the biggest advocates for some of the things you believe, and yet you make me into a horrible monster because I like women and think it's all right. I'm the first one standing up in a thread about God, and I was the one who backed up your belief that pornography is wrong in the porn thread. When people attacked you, or your jokes, and took the Christian-bashing too far, guess who stood up for you? The big gay monster.
| | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:07 superman14 |
365 posts
| i don't like people who use scripture as the base for everything...homosexuality is an abomination to the lord?
You should us scripture as a base for everything.
Lev.15:19- 24: no contact with women during their period of menstual uncleanliness, must make the work environment awkward huh?
Women didn't not work back then.
Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations, does this mean i may own an american or a mexican as long as i pay?
That's what Moses premitted, not God.
Exodus 35:2 says that people who work on the sabbath should be put to death? how many wal mart have you burned down that were open on sundays?
The Sabbath is Saturday, not Sunday. Sunday is the Lord's day.
Lev. 11:10: says that eating shellfish is an abomination. is this abomination on par with homosexuality. If so why aren't red lobsters boycotted en masse
If you read the law that was for the Jewish people. Later in the New Testiment God permitted the eating of animals that the Jews considered unclean. Where as with homosexuality it is prohibited in both.
seriously with all these ridiculous laws, how can you look at these laws here and then say yeah, the homosexuality one stands alone as the voice of reason law in the midst of all these inane and outdated archaic ones, its silly and hypocritical, if you really "live by scripture", i personally think you should go all or nothing, otherwise YOU are deliberately distorting scripture to suit your faith
What you have to look at is what is in the Old Testiment, and what is in the New. Devorce was permitted in the Old Testiment, but Jesus says it's not. (unless for sexual fornacation Matthew 5) Where as Homosexuallity is prohibated in both. | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:08 superman14 |
365 posts
| You are so naive, it almost hurts
And you're so gay it almost hurts | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:10 Dagor |
34,870 posts
|  | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:16 superman14 |
365 posts
| 4. I think it's funny how I'm one of the biggest advocates for some of the things you believe, and yet you make me into a horrible monster because I like women and think it's all right. I'm the first one standing up in a thread about God, and I was the one who backed up your belief that pornography is wrong in the porn thread. When people attacked you, or your jokes, and took the Christian-bashing too far, guess who stood up for you? The big gay monster.
When have I once called you a monster? Sure we are arguing scripture here but I have never once doubted you. If I have made you into a monster I am very sorry. For I am glad to have you backing me. Yes I believe you are wrong, but I have never, ever doubted your faith, or that you are a good person or anything. I ask that you will forgive me if you felt like I am attacking you, because I am not at all trying to do that. I am purely just debating scripture. I am very greatful of your support, please don't stop at all. Just because we have different oppinions does not mean I hate you. Are we cool?
* offtopic :
I thought it best to address this first before we continue debating
| | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:19 Dagor |
34,870 posts
| Have you ever considered it a thought that the bible is irrelevant in this matter? | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:22 superman14 |
365 posts
| Have you ever considered it a thought that the bible is irrelevant in this matter?
It's never irrelevant. Have you ever considered it relevant? | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:24 Dagor |
34,870 posts
| No, not at all .. to me it's just a book with pretty ancient and therefore primitive points of view | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:25 superman14 |
365 posts
| No, not at all .. to me it's just a book with pretty ancient and therefore primitive points of view
And to me it's the guide book of life. And it says you're wrong | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:28 Dagor |
34,870 posts
| Look, kiddo, if you want to stick to your bible, then do. Jurisdiction is not based on the bible. And for a good reason. It favours discrimination, which is not tolerable in a democratic society. | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:29 KateKateKate |
5,285 posts
| You told me that it was people like me that are the problem with Christianity, I'm not sure exactly how I'm supposed to take that, when I live my life better than a lot of people I know who call themselves a Christian, and follow pretty much everything the church and Bible has to say (minus this supposed gayness, but even then, it's not like I'm having sex with women at all, I hold myself to the same standards I'd hold a heterosexual couple, wait until you're married blah blah anyway).
Yeah, we're fine, I know it's easy to get caught up in Biblical debate. I just think it's something to be careful with. If you look at some of my old posts (wouldn't find them on this account, you'd find them on the biteme13 account) I think you'd be very surprised by what I had to say, especially with regards to homosexuality.
But yeah, it's something to be careful about. As much as we'd like to think so faith and religion aren't as cut and dry as we'd like, and the Bible isn't a straightforward list. It does tell us what is moral and what is not but you need to be aware of what's happening at the time it was written, because that is who it was written for and what it was inspired by, and what it ends up being about is taking the truth that is within those Scriptures and seeing how it applies to today. I think that everything ultimately connects to respect for the self and the other...down to all the sexual sins. I just don't think homosexuality really fits in with beatiality, pedophilia, incest, etc. | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:50 superman14 |
365 posts
| You told me that it was people like me that are the problem with Christianity, I'm not sure exactly how I'm supposed to take that, when I live my life better than a lot of people I know who call themselves a Christian, and follow pretty much everything the church and Bible has to say (minus this supposed gayness, but even then, it's not like I'm having sex with women at all, I hold myself to the same standards I'd hold a heterosexual couple, wait until you're married blah blah anyway).
Well when I said that I was refering to how I believe you are watering down the word. Not about how you live your life. I would never attack whether anyone is a good person.
Yeah, we're fine, I know it's easy to get caught up in Biblical debate. I just think it's something to be careful with.
I'm glad. When we are debating we need to hold each other responsible for what we say. We need to be examples whether we agree or not. Deal?
But yeah, it's something to be careful about. As much as we'd like to think so faith and religion aren't as cut and dry as we'd like, and the Bible isn't a straightforward list. It does tell us what is moral and what is not but you need to be aware of what's happening at the time it was written, because that is who it was written for and what it was inspired by
Which is why we need to compare what is written in the Old Testament, and New. | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 18:58 JDolla | 
7,721 posts
| how can you take everything in the bible literally? it has been translated from hebrew to greek, then to latin, and then into whatever language you choose to read it in. so much must have been lost in translation that you really cant take everything literally. figures of speach, words that had no translation from one language to the next, and things that the translator thought would be implied may be missing. the important part is the main message, the rest is just details. details that can be open to interpretation. if everything was to be taken literally, then why are there so mand different denominations of christianity? does that mean that all but one are wrong? | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 19:00 KateKateKate |
5,285 posts
| You're right, the New Testament certainly did clarify some things. But see, if Paul is living in the same kind of environment that the Old Testament writers were living in (one where everyone was sexually promiscuous and only having sex with people of the same sex for kicks and not love) then of course he would also forbid it.
There's still people like that who exist today. People who aren't actually gay, but who enjoy homosexual contact because they see it as "kinky." Gay isn't just about a sexual attraction, gay is about an emotional attraction as well. What Paul would have a problem with today is a guy who, say, has a wife or girlfriend and is completely straight, has no emotional attraction to men, going to a gloryhole to get a blowjob. What Paul would have a problem with is a girl who decides she wants to have sex with one of her female friends at a party just to "try it out" when she knows perfectly well she has no other attraction to a female, other than wanting to give it a try to see if it's hot. Would Paul have a problem with two gay people who wanted to be in a permanent relationship? It's debatable, but somehow I doubt it. | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 19:02 KateKateKate |
5,285 posts
| Plus, if we're saying the Old Testament is completely valid (but Jesus still had to come to fulfill it, clarify some points, not change anything) then who is to say that when he returns again he isn't going to say the same thing? That he isn't going to tell us we've messed up, that we've missed the point? | | 0 @ 01-11-2007 19:10 JDolla |
7,721 posts
| all i have to say |
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