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The Abortion Thread
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@ 06-04-2005 16:37 Lind_ | 12 posts
|  Hey you guys!!!
We're doing this projekt in school about an ethical dilemma  , and Iv'e chosen abortion. Could be really usefull to hear your oppinion  and why you think like you do. So if you feel for it pls write what you think about it.  xox Linda |
| Showing posts 176-200 of 278 | Page 8 of 12 |
| Discussion |
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 0  @ 31-10-2006 14:07 suzieblue | 111 posts
| And what about test tube babies? They are not the outcome of conception, so are they therefore not living, and we may massacre them as we like?
Do you agree with test tube babies? | | 0 @ 30-01-2007 00:46 victoria325 | 20 posts
| I believe a woman as the right to decide what to do with her own body. Even if there are no safety concerns with the mother and shes even married to the father does someone have the right to tell her to go through a pregnancy?? The baby wouldnt live on its own outside the body so its not indepentdent and therefore i dont beloeve it has the same rights as you or me. Yes it does have the potential to become you or me but its still not. | | 0 @ 06-03-2007 20:02 FiVEWiSHES | 
187 posts
| At the moment of conception, there IS a heartbeat. so don't think that it's not. there's a heartbeat, therefore a living organism. like i said, i would never get an abortion, but i'm not going to stop you from getting one. i would not encourage it though. | | 0 @ 07-03-2007 15:11 Pandora | 
22,886 posts
| the babies heart doesn't start beating until around 6 weeks after conception.. =\
it's not like you have sex then POW a baby is fully formed, it has to grow.
rockon
tabitha | | 0 @ 07-03-2007 21:55 FiVEWiSHES |
187 posts
| actually, the embryotic heart starts beating 22 days after conception. so yes, i was wrong i should looked further into it (sorry!). but still, my personal choice is that once that heart starts beating who am i to stop it? it's a human life. personal choice is what it's about. have an abortion, and the best i could do is advise against it. i'm not going to shove beliefs down anyone's throat. everyone has a right to express themselves. if you feel abortion is for you, then go ahead. | | 0 @ 08-03-2007 03:43 Playmate01 | 
3,893 posts
| abortion isnt for anyone. its something that needs to be done. | | 0 @ 15-03-2007 17:55 Pandora |
22,886 posts
| abortion isnt for anyone. its something that needs to be done.
... that makes no sense.
So I got all riled up about this again last night because a speaker came and talked in our youth group last night about abortion.
The only thing abortion wise that could even be possibly considered a necessity.. is if the pregnancy/birth are fatal for the mother. But abortions based on clinical necessity are less than 5% of them performed.
That 5% also includes patients who have aborted their babies because of rape or incest.
Most of the abortions done worldwide are for convience... oh we can't afford it.. or my lifestyle doesn't have a place for a baby... or maybe 'we're just not responsible enough to have a child'... I'm all for these people being completely isolated and cut off from the world because they are too much of an inconvience to society.
Most people don't even know the gruesome details entangled in abortion.. it's not pretty it's not easy .. most women go through post abortion syndrome ... and that's something that's highly overlooked.. it's not just a baby that's being killed in this process.. women don't think or hear about the effects on themselves before they have these procedures...
So just a little FYI.. : ( you don't have to read this, but there are alot of people that don't know this.. and it may have already been mentioned, but I will feel better if I personally, say it again )
The Types of Abortion :
Suction Abortion: Used during the first three months of pregnancy - A suction tube (27 times more powerful than a household vaccum) is inserted into the womb. The powerful suction tears the baby apart limb from limb and sucks it from the womb along with the placenta. The baby's remains are deposited into an attached waste bottle.. the nurse pieces the baby together on a table to make sure they have all of it's pieces. it looks something like this and to say that this isn't even remotely 'developed' c'mon.. it looks like it's getting somewhere to me.
Dilation and Curettage (D&C): Used at the end of the third month of pregnancy (approximately 12 weeks) - The cervix is dialated, ring forceps are inserted into the womb and the baby is cut into pieces and removed then the womb is scraped away any of the baby or the placenta that remains. Profuse bleeding follows.
Dilation and Extraction (D&E): This method is used up to 18 weeks' gestation. Instead of the loop-shaped knife used in D&C abortions, a pair of forceps is inserted into the womb to grasp part of the fetus. The teeth of the forceps twist and tear the bones of the unborn child. This process is repeated until the fetus is totally dismembered and removed. Usually the spine must be snapped and the skull crushed in order to remove them. After the baby parts are removed, they are reassembled outside the womb to be sure all are removed. Frequently baby parts are left inside the mother's womb. This can cause serious complications and sometimes death.
.. just so you know by 12 weeks the baby has vocal chords and can cry silently, the brain is fully formed and the child can feel pain... the fetus can even suck his thumb.. by 14 weeks the baby starts moving because its muscles have become organized.. and at 15 weeks it's taste buds are developed enough to taste the mothers meals.
Saline injection ("Salting Out"):
Used after 16 weeks (four months) when enough fluid has accumulated. A long needle injects a strong salt solution through the mother's abdomen into the baby's sac. The baby swallows this fluid and is poisoned by it. It also acts as a corrosive, burning off the outer layer of skin. He/she kicks and jerks violently as he/she is literally being burned alive. It normally takes somewhat over an hour for the baby to die from this. Within 24 hours, labor will usually set in and the mother will give birth to a dead or dying baby . (There have been many cases of these babies being born alive. They are usually left unattended to die. However, a few have survived and later been adopted.) Use has declined because of dangers for the mother and because sometimes the baby survives.
By 16 weeks.. the child can grasp with his hands, kick or even somersault in the womb.. I can't imagine being a mother feeling her baby die inside of her... violently. Most people say it's 'painless'... but for whom is it exactly painless?
Dilitation and Extraction (D and X - Partial-Birth Abortion):
Partial Birth Abortion could very well be the worse case... these babies are capable of early birth and could survive if given the chance.
I'll just go through the steps:
1) Guided by ultrasound, the abortionist locates the baby's legs and feet, he uses large forceps to grasp one of the baby's legs forcing the child into a 'feet down' position. Mind you, the baby is normally in the 'birthing position' when this is done, meaning that the baby's head is at the opening of the birth canal and his feet are at the top, so he must be completely jerked into a reverse position. He continues pulling until the baby's leg is drawn into the birth canal.
2) The baby's body is pulled by the doctor's hands.. and delivered leg, torso, shoulders, and then arms. And the baby's head remains inside the uterus.
WHY you may ask.. does the baby's head have to stay inside the uterus.. ? undelivered as the rest of his parts?
Because if the baby were live born, it would suddenly be considered murder to kill it. Even though a baby can be born live, and left unattended to die on it's own, you can't discard a perfectly well born baby. Moving on..
3) The last step is sometimes called 'fetal skull decompression'... using blunt tipped surgical scissors in a closed position, the childs head is stabbed at the base of the skull. The scissors are then opened to enlarge the skull opening so that a suction tube can be placed inside the skull... then the doctor 'vaccums' out the child's brain tissue... the skull collapses and the dead baby is removed.
an account :
"I stood at the doctor's side and watched him perform a partial-birth abortion on a woman who was six months pregnant. The baby's heartbeat was clearly visible on the ultrasound screen. The doctor delivered the baby's body and arms, everything but his little head. The baby's body was moving. His little fingers were clasping together. He was kicking his feet. The doctor took a pair of scissors and inserted them into the back of the baby's head, and the baby's arms jerked out in a flinch, a startle reaction, like a baby does when he thinks that he might fall. Then the doctor opened the scissors up. Then he stuck the high-powered suction tube into the hole and sucked the baby's brains out. Now the baby was completely limp. I never went back to the clinic. But I am still haunted by the face of that little boy. It was the most perfect, angelic face I have ever seen."
This procedure.. is dangerous to the mother as well as fatal to the baby. Instead of just having a live birth and giving the child up for adoption, the mother is put through the gruesome task of manuvering the child into a breech birth position and birthing in an awkward more painful and damaging position than that of a natural birth.
The leading causes of abortion related deaths come from bleeding and infection... the risk for breast cancer doubles after an abortion and rises with each there after... Increased cervical/ovarian/liver cancer rates are linked to the unnatural disruption of the hormonal changes which accompany pregnancy, and the untreated cervical damage... During later pregnancies many cases showed handicapped children or even a greater risk for miscarriage or even infertility.
... I duno for now I think I have rattled enough but yea.. just think about it... I'm not going to post more pictures or anything to pose a shock factor, you all have google and can look at them for yourself.. I was just amazed at how many people really have no idea what these abortions include.
Tell me how and why, this is something that needs to be done?
rockon
tabitha | | 0 @ 15-03-2007 19:21 sweet_J_ | 17,089 posts
| Agreed. Thanks for posting that Tabitha. People really need to see this.
I was Pro-life before, but now that I have watched a human life grow inside of me I'm even more Pro-life now. | | 0 @ 15-03-2007 19:25 sweet_J_ | 17,089 posts
| Just to add to this....I saw my baby's heartbeat when I was 4 weeks along.
I think it should be mandatory for abortion clinics to show the women their baby's heart beat before going any furthur in the procedure. I'm willing to bet that more than half would not go through with the abortion.
I could just read from my pregnancy books about how they develop each week. It's truly miraculous. It's not just a cluster of cells...it's a human LIFE. | | 0 @ 15-03-2007 19:29 vandy | 
9,527 posts
| I'm so glad there are other people on here who are still strongly pro-life.
There are a lot of values that I have now that I might not have if I wasn't religious.
However, I think I would be pro-life even if I didn't believe in any God or worship system. To me, it seems like common sense. | | 0 @ 15-03-2007 20:12 NightHobbit | 
23,475 posts
| I have a new opinion on the matter... not going to dictate peoples choices on if they do or don't. I am not in their circumstance I really have no right to. | | 0 @ 15-03-2007 20:33 Pandora |
22,886 posts
| ^ no you don't ... but alot of women that get abortions are forced into them by their male partners... or they don't know the risks before they have it done.. awareness is a huge part of it.
The statistics are truly amazing too... when I get off work I'll post some up... but you wouldn't believe how many babies are killed in a year throughout the world, just becasue they are considered an 'inconvience'..
I don't think people should be able to shove off there consequences so easily...
Someone has to stand up for the children that can'd stand up for themselves..
rockon
tabitha | | 0 @ 15-03-2007 20:43 NightHobbit |
23,475 posts
| unrelating but i thought it was note worthy, i think stem cell research though shouldn't be forbidden. its something good coming out of abortion. | | 0 @ 15-03-2007 20:45 andro | 
42,248 posts
| Pretty gruesome imagery... Although I will be sticking to my pro-choice viewpoint. I still feel that it is the prospective mother's right to choose whether she wants to go through with an abortion or not, and that she deserves to have access to all of the information and support she needs while making that difficult choice. | | 0 @ 15-03-2007 23:28 KateKateKate | 
5,285 posts
| ...I shouldn't have clicked the dead babies while I was eating.
But anyway. There was a girl who got pregnant by her boyfriend last year in my school. She had already had an abortion before, and after she did it she had a really hard time with herself. Her boyfriend told her to get another abortion. And she had to, cause she knew if she didn't, she'd be pregnant and alone cause he would leave her. So basically he emotionally blackmailed her. I think it's pretty sick. People need to start being more careful, cause frankly I hear too many people bragging about not having safe sex. | | 0 @ 05-04-2007 18:28 Pandora |
22,886 posts
| article
this guy was arrested and given jail time for attempting to kill his ex girlfriends nearly term fetus... who she have been given the same punishment if she had attempted to kill it herself?
rockon
tabitha | | 0 @ 05-04-2007 19:04 PunkRckr8 | 
10,029 posts
| but alot of women that get abortions are forced into them by their male partners
if anyone is weak-minded enough to be "forced" into getting an abortion by their partner, they don't deserve to have kids anyway | | 0 @ 05-04-2007 19:08 Pandora |
22,886 posts
| alot of it really isn't weak mindedness... if you are young and afraid of ltelling your family, add on that you only have your boyfriend to turn to... and he insists that you get an abortion, girls are easily swayed. Especially if they don't talk to anyone else about it.
The same with women afraid of their guys leaving them.. alot of abortions are had by people dependent on others around them.. it's sad, but I think those people should have a chance to be made more aware of the risks.
rockon
tabitha | | 0 @ 05-04-2007 19:12 sweet_J_ | 17,089 posts
| Agreed...and they should be more aware of what they are destroying. | | 0 @ 05-04-2007 19:12 PunkRckr8 |
10,029 posts
| I also think everyone needs to be more well informed, but if they are incapable of doing so on their own, I take that as an indication of not being a fully functioning adult, and therefore they should not be having children anyway.
Its just my socialist side poking through, at times I think people should need a license to breed. . .but that's a whole other can of worms and I don't want to hijack the thread into a discussion on who should and should not be fornicating. | | 0 @ 05-04-2007 19:14 Pandora |
22,886 posts
| oh I'm definitely on the 'license to breed' deal... but alot of girls go into abortions completely blinded .. some of the greatest concerns are the harm is causes the mother as well... not just the death of a fetus.
rockon
tabitha | | 0 @ 19-04-2007 03:12 auddierose | 2 posts
| How can you people say that a fetus is not a living thing?! At the point of conception, it is living. He may not have a heart beat yet, but he's still a baby. No one told you not to wear a condom or have any type of birth control! No one even told you to have to begin with! If you are not responsible enough to at the VERY least carry a baby, than you are not responsible enough to have sex. Why would you go for abortion? I just dont understand it when there are so many families out there who can never get pregnant and who would love to have a baby? Why can't you just put the child up for adoption instead of killing them? Do you even know what they do? Just google it. Type in 22 weeks gestation and click images. There are some things that even walk you through the whole procedure and gives you pictures of an aborted fetus. It is horrible and I, personally, have absolutely no respect for anyone who kills an innocent child. He never asked to be conceived. Every pregnancy and every birth is a miracle, no matter what you people say. | | 0 @ 07-05-2007 23:29 Brianthegamer | 87 posts
| Abortion is just wrong. It's killing a human being, plain and simple. It doesn't matter how old they are; killing another human being merely to suit one's own (selfish) purposes is morally reprehensible.
Even if it is the lesser of 2 evils (and I'm not agreeing that it is), it's still evil. There's always the third option, that is, be a good parent and either raise the kid (if possible) or adopt him/her out. However, you can't just throw away human life like it's nothing! To live is something wonderful, and to take it away is the most heinous of acts. | | 0 @ 08-05-2007 00:15 mikey_boy | 20,467 posts
| no you don't ... but alot of women that get abortions are forced into them by their male partners... or they don't know the risks before they have it done.. awareness is a huge part of it.
no they're not. i know a girl who just got an abortion and it was her decision and her's only. she believed she couldnt raise a child right now. now, grant it, my personal opinion of her shouldnt count on this, but she was right. if she had a kid at this point in her life, her kid would have died a month after being birthed.
abortion isnt something to shun people over. so you posted some pictures, whoop-de-doo. someone getting an abortion is their personal decision. let it be. this goes back to every single argument people make about stuff like gay marriage, it doesnt hurt you. it doesnt affect your life and make you unable to live, it doesnt infringe on your freedom, if anything your attempting to to infringe on someone elses by not allowing them to make the best decision for them and their potential child. i'd much rather see a woman get an abortion if she isnt ready to have a kid then see her kid struggle to be raised in a good life. even adaption doesnt always work. there are lot of kids who are born, given for adoption and then arent adopted.
so seriously, stop trying to be so involved in people's lives, let them do what they want. if it doesnt hurt you or affect you, let it go. worry about your life and how you can better yourself instead of trying to change others lives to appease yours. | | 0 @ 08-05-2007 03:32 Pippin247 | 
2,652 posts
| the arguments are too long for me to read right now, but I used to be pretty anti-abortion when I was more into the catholic church, but now that my lifes not consumed by them, I know that if I found out that I was pregnant right now, I'd want an abortion. |
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